Comments on: Garret Anderson: immensely overrated http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719 This and that about baseball stats. Fri, 11 Nov 2011 16:57:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Stat of the Day » Corey Patterson is awful http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5216 Stat of the Day » Corey Patterson is awful Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:20:57 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5216 [...] last time I ripped a player, it caused a bit of a firestorm. Somehow I think I’ll get less resistance this [...] [...] last time I ripped a player, it caused a bit of a firestorm. Somehow I think I’ll get less resistance this [...]

]]> By: gerry http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5162 gerry Thu, 24 Jul 2008 05:14:31 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5162 I'd like to second Johnny's call for a sidebar in comment 17, above. It's done that way at Hardball Times, and it's a good feature, and I prefer it to the alternatives Raphy & Andy suggest (although those are good ideas, too). I'd like to second Johnny's call for a sidebar in comment 17, above. It's done that way at Hardball Times, and it's a good feature, and I prefer it to the alternatives Raphy & Andy suggest (although those are good ideas, too).

]]> By: Johnny Twisto http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5159 Johnny Twisto Thu, 24 Jul 2008 04:52:17 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5159 Ooh, I don't know about all that stuff. I'll try to figure it out, thanks. Ooh, I don't know about all that stuff. I'll try to figure it out, thanks.

]]> By: Andy http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5155 Andy Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:58:33 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5155 Oh, and Johnny, if you don't use a newsreader, you can still visit the page for the RSS feed for comments--it will always show the most recent comments on there. Or if you use Firefox you can use one of those fancy bookmarks that shows all updates. Oh, and Johnny, if you don't use a newsreader, you can still visit the page for the RSS feed for comments--it will always show the most recent comments on there. Or if you use Firefox you can use one of those fancy bookmarks that shows all updates.

]]> By: Andy http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5154 Andy Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:55:52 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5154 I dig him, pageup1000. I dig him, pageup1000.

]]> By: pageup1000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5153 pageup1000 Wed, 23 Jul 2008 22:39:41 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5153 Will you dig Frank Howard at 142+. Who knew? Will you dig Frank Howard at 142+. Who knew?

]]> By: Raphy http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5152 Raphy Wed, 23 Jul 2008 21:23:10 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5152 Johnny, you can subscribe to the comments rss in the Meta section in the sidebar. Johnny, you can subscribe to the comments rss in the Meta section in the sidebar.

]]> By: Johnny Twisto http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5151 Johnny Twisto Wed, 23 Jul 2008 19:11:00 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5151 I notice Renteria on that list....with Anderson slowing down, Renteria might be the player who now most threatens the 3000 hit plateau, despite not seeming to be a "great" player. Incidentally, Andy, could you see if Sean has a way to link the most recent comments on the sidebar or something? Sometimes a post like this has been pushed way down the page, but the conversation remains interesting, but I bet a lot of people miss it because they don't realize new comments are still being added. You either have to click on every single post every time you visit, or kind of remember how many comments were there before and see if the # has changed. I notice Renteria on that list....with Anderson slowing down, Renteria might be the player who now most threatens the 3000 hit plateau, despite not seeming to be a "great" player.

Incidentally, Andy, could you see if Sean has a way to link the most recent comments on the sidebar or something? Sometimes a post like this has been pushed way down the page, but the conversation remains interesting, but I bet a lot of people miss it because they don't realize new comments are still being added. You either have to click on every single post every time you visit, or kind of remember how many comments were there before and see if the # has changed.

]]> By: Andy http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5150 Andy Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:44:28 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5150 Johnny, I agree with your assessment. To me, the issue is that Anderson gets way more credit than he deserves. Yes, he had a peak period where he was a great player, and overall he's good. (Mind you, I think there is some misconception about what I mean by "average"---being an "average" major league is nothing to sneeze at.) But just like Steve Finley, Anderson gets a lot of credit for amassing certain career totals that he has achieved mainly through longevity and staying healthy. There's nothing wrong with longevity and staying healthy. Imagine if Mo Vaughn and Albert Belle could have had those traits. But he's simply very overrated as a hitter by the mainstream media. To see just how soft Anderson is, check out this list (link below) of players over the last 15 years with at least 7000 PAs and a BA between .290 and .300. Anderson is right in the middle at .295. His 104 career OPS+ is truly pathetic, just ahead of lightweights like Jason Kendall and Mark Grudzielanek. He's even less productive than Kenny Lofton and is light years behind Bobby Abreu, Jeff Kent, and Brian Giles. http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/7khV By the way, user "thebest" and I cleared the air in an off-line discussion. Johnny, I agree with your assessment. To me, the issue is that Anderson gets way more credit than he deserves. Yes, he had a peak period where he was a great player, and overall he's good. (Mind you, I think there is some misconception about what I mean by "average"---being an "average" major league is nothing to sneeze at.)

But just like Steve Finley, Anderson gets a lot of credit for amassing certain career totals that he has achieved mainly through longevity and staying healthy. There's nothing wrong with longevity and staying healthy. Imagine if Mo Vaughn and Albert Belle could have had those traits. But he's simply very overrated as a hitter by the mainstream media.

To see just how soft Anderson is, check out this list (link below) of players over the last 15 years with at least 7000 PAs and a BA between .290 and .300. Anderson is right in the middle at .295. His 104 career OPS+ is truly pathetic, just ahead of lightweights like Jason Kendall and Mark Grudzielanek. He's even less productive than Kenny Lofton and is light years behind Bobby Abreu, Jeff Kent, and Brian Giles.

http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/7khV

By the way, user "thebest" and I cleared the air in an off-line discussion.

]]> By: Johnny Twisto http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/719/comment-page-1#comment-5149 Johnny Twisto Wed, 23 Jul 2008 18:25:54 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/sotd/?p=719#comment-5149 I think Andy really overstates his case by calling Anderson "average" and Joe Carter "bad." In their primes they were both good players. Anderson was a good left fielder who played every single day, batted .300 with decent power. He was no superstar and he was overrated, but a very fine player for a while. Thebest, the reason why we don't think Anderson was a great player is because the Triple Crown categories just don't give the whole measure of a player's offensive contributions. First, Anderson was a LF, which requires less defensive ability than any other position except perhaps 1B, and therefore demands more offense. Consequently, hitting 25-30 HR is nice, but not at all special. Secondly, Anderson's hit and RBI totals are inflated because he rarely walked. Therefore despite his good BA, he got on base less than average, which is revealed in his Run totals. I don't dismiss RBI like many statheads do, but equally as important as RBI are runs scored. Anderson topped 90 only twice in a season. For a corner outfielder in this high-scoring era, that's pathetic. So while Anderson drove in runs, you would find the guys batting behind him didn't get the chance to drive in as many. He did not contribute as much to the TEAM's scoring as his RBI totals would indicate. I think Andy really overstates his case by calling Anderson "average" and Joe Carter "bad." In their primes they were both good players. Anderson was a good left fielder who played every single day, batted .300 with decent power. He was no superstar and he was overrated, but a very fine player for a while.

Thebest, the reason why we don't think Anderson was a great player is because the Triple Crown categories just don't give the whole measure of a player's offensive contributions. First, Anderson was a LF, which requires less defensive ability than any other position except perhaps 1B, and therefore demands more offense. Consequently, hitting 25-30 HR is nice, but not at all special. Secondly, Anderson's hit and RBI totals are inflated because he rarely walked. Therefore despite his good BA, he got on base less than average, which is revealed in his Run totals. I don't dismiss RBI like many statheads do, but equally as important as RBI are runs scored. Anderson topped 90 only twice in a season. For a corner outfielder in this high-scoring era, that's pathetic. So while Anderson drove in runs, you would find the guys batting behind him didn't get the chance to drive in as many. He did not contribute as much to the TEAM's scoring as his RBI totals would indicate.

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