Comments on: Jeff Nelson At His Peak

By: FCAlive

FCAlive — Sun, 17 Feb 2008 06:50:59 +0000

I don't think this is a fair comparison either. Nelson was a very good pitcher, and relievers who can get 2-3 clean outs are extremely valuable, but comparing the stats of a closer to a setup man doesn't really make much sense. The AL/NL difference is also weird. I know that OPS+ is corrected for the league, but I kinda figure Hoffman's career would have been something like John Wetteland's if he had stayed in the AL.

By: Johnny Twisto

Johnny Twisto — Fri, 15 Feb 2008 21:02:13 +0000

And the HBP too. That's what drove Yankee fans and Joe Torre nuts. Nelson could be nasty, but sometimes he just couldn't get the ball over the plate in big spots.

Since 1893, Nelson has the 5th most HBP of any pitcher with fewer than 1000 IP. #1 is Byung-Hyun Kim. 7th is Steve Reed. Something about those sidearmers, I guess.

By: AMusingFool

AMusingFool — Fri, 15 Feb 2008 19:39:53 +0000

If you subtract walks, that's pretty close... That's a pretty big difference in walks, though.

By: Andy

Andy — Fri, 15 Feb 2008 19:35:59 +0000

I agree with Johnny that the OPS+ difference is pretty significant, especially because of how that scale works.

I found it surprising that Hoffman pitched more outs per appearance than Nelson...I definitely would have guessed the other way around.

By: Steve Lombardi

Steve Lombardi — Fri, 15 Feb 2008 18:41:38 +0000

Actually, I was just looking at Nelson, and who was close to him, and Hoffman came up. Before playing with PI, I never thought of pairing the two.

By: Johnny Twisto

Johnny Twisto — Fri, 15 Feb 2008 16:33:48 +0000

An odd pairing, what made you think of this? I dunno, I think the difference is greater than you. I think 11 points of OPS+ against is fairly notable. Nelson's oppOBP is 70 points higher than Hoffman's -- that's huge. Nelson gave up a lot more SB too, which in late-and-close situations could be pretty meaningful. And of course ERA isn't necessarily that useful for relievers. Nelson's ERA is helped by all the partial innings he pitched. He had 281 appearances during this period of 2/3 IP or less. Hoffman had only 89. Nelson allowed about 28% of inherited runners to score; Hoffman only 20%. (Could there be a big difference in the types of inherited runner situations they faced? I'm not sure.) But Nelson sonned Hoffman in Holds - 160 to 16!!!