Comments on: Tim Raines – correction – the MLB batting debut that wasn’t

By: Andy

Andy — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 23:30:03 +0000

You are right. I thought I discussed that in a subsequent post, but maybe not. A reader wrote in with that info.

By: ImAShark

ImAShark — Tue, 30 Oct 2007 22:52:33 +0000

I'm pretty sure that Barry Bonds' first at bat came in a situation similar to this, and I found it out when looking through his 1986 gamelog.

By: Andy

Andy — Sun, 26 Aug 2007 20:19:03 +0000

Ok, but then how do you account for this?

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/1332/2100/200/gooden89T.jpg

By: giacalone

giacalone — Sun, 26 Aug 2007 19:12:10 +0000

In Raines' defense about the "Rock" thing, his situation is similar to the one encountered by Dick Allen. Raines had been called "Rock" by nearly everyone close to him all of his life. Around baseball, however, writers all insisted upon calling him Tim. Everywhere that he went, he asked the sportswriters to use "Rock," but no one complied. I don't think that it's too much to ask that a player be called what he wishes.

By: tangotiger

tangotiger — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 21:03:19 +0000

I'd also include Paul Molitor in there. According to b-r's Linear Weights numbers, Molitor has +34 batting wins, as does Raines. Gwynn is at +43 wins. Raines of course was a fantastic base stealer, and an excellent base runner. Molitor was excellent in both. Gwynn was above average. Fielding is tough. Molitor was the better fielder, but he also spent a substantial portion at DH. Overall, not much separate the three.

By: David in Toledo

David in Toledo — Fri, 24 Aug 2007 13:38:13 +0000

Tony Gwynn and Tim Raines made essentially equivalent contributions to their teams at about the same time in baseball history -- right down to their career win share totals: Gwynn, 398; Raines, 390. I don't know details of their biographies. But Gwynn grew up in California and went to college and then played in the same city his whole career. Raines grew up in Florida (think lingering segregation), didn't go to college, and played all over the map. I doubt that Tim's life path was as easy as Tony's.

By: tangotiger

tangotiger — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 19:49:52 +0000

I don't know how many 23yr old ballplayers have voluntarily come forward to seek rehab and tell the world what a mistake they made. Usually, it takes a run-in with the law for that to happen.

By: Andy

Andy — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 15:51:48 +0000

statboy--I considered that, but I try not to be judgmental about addictive drugs. It's very easy to criticize individuals over issues involving alcohol, drugs, gambling and other addictive behaviors. But they are complicated phenomena that often involve a lot of external issues. Raines himself said in the Baseball Prospectus interview that he was young and made a mistake, and I for one am not going to judge him based on his cocaine use.

By: statboy

statboy — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 15:48:14 +0000

Andy, I hated seeing "Rock Raines" on his cards too, but I vote THIS as the worst thing about Tim Raines...

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=pearlman/070613
"As they tend to do (fairly, I believe), Hall of Fame voters will recall Raines' unfortunate early claim to fame -- the fact that he slid headfirst so he wouldn't puncture the bag of coke in his back uniform pocket."

By: Andy

Andy — Thu, 23 Aug 2007 13:18:48 +0000

I guess that it's sort of ironic, given that neither the Texas Rangers nor the Minnesota Twins reflect much on their previous lives as the Washington Senators.