Comments on: Roy Smalley Jr. http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067 This and that about baseball stats. Tue, 16 Jul 2013 17:01:55 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.6 By: Jim Sexton http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-179523 Sun, 30 Oct 2011 02:17:19 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-179523 One of my earliest memories of major league baseball was a game in the early 50's between the Pirates and Phillies. In the last of the 9th, Gene Freeze (Pirates) hit a presumed base hit with a guy in scoring position, who easily scored. Roy Smalley (shortstop for the Phillies) watched the play despite the fact that everyone was leaving, celebrating, etc. Freeze watched the action and went to the dugout. Smalley called for the ball, tagged first base, and the alert umpire called Freeze out. Extra innings, and as I recall, the Phillies won. I was about ten, and I learned something important from that.

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By: MCT http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-178382 Fri, 28 Oct 2011 16:18:38 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-178382 "Roy Smalley III, born October 25, 1952, was the first overall pick by the Texas Rangers in the January 1974 draft. I have never been able to figure out the purpose and qualifications for the January drafts and the supplemental drafts that were part of both the January and June drafts until the mid-1980s. Before signing with Texas at that point, he was picked in various drafts four times. He was traded to the Twins in the middle of the 1976 season.."

I am curious about this as well. It's my impression that the secondary drafts may have been for players who had previously been drafted but had not signed, while the (regular) January draft may have been for players who had reached some eligibility milestone (such as age or graduation) since the last draft was held. I would love to find out more about how all this worked.

Including his final selection by the Rangers, Smalley was drafted five times: in the regular June 1970 draft by the Expos; in three different Secondary Drafts (January 1971, June 1971, and January 1972) by two different teams; then by the Rangers in the regular January 1974 draft. If my above theory is correct, Smalley's selection in June 1970 was following his high school graduation, his three secondary selections were because he had not signed and gone to college instead, and his selection in January 1974 was because he had turned 21 in October 1973. This would raise the question of why no one drafted him in the June 1972, January 1973 and June 1973 drafts. It could be that there was a limit on the number of times or length of time over which an unsigned player could be selected.

Under today's rules, I believe that once Smalley elected to attend a four-year college, he would not be eligible again until he either completed his senior year or turned 21. So he would have been eligible in June 1970 and again in June (not January) 1974, not any time in between.

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By: Stu B http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-178175 Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:16:59 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-178175 @19: "We've lost a few players born in or close to 1952 already."

Given that those born in '52 will turn 60 next year, that is (unfortunately) to be expected. Even with longer life expectancy, those of us over 50 aren't kids anymore!

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By: Bill Tuck http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-178072 Fri, 28 Oct 2011 05:48:27 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-178072 When I was growing up in California, I remember hearing Roy Smalley's name on game of the day broadcasts. I also remember when Roy III was drafted high and played in the American League.
After I grew up, I had a coworker in San Jose who came from Chicago. He always spoke disparinglly of Roy, Jr.
I also remember when Roy, III and his wife had a son, he said they did not name the boy Roy, IV.

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By: DoubleDiamond http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-177977 Fri, 28 Oct 2011 02:33:34 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-177977 I also saw the Roy Smalley, Jr., name in the "In Memoriam" section and thought it was the younger of the two players with this name. I knew that the guy I always thought of as Roy Jr. was born in the same year I was, 1952, and that he celebrated his 35th birthday in 1987 by being part of the World Series-winning Minnesota Twins. He made a pinch hitting appearance and walked in that game, which was on October 25. And the date I saw the Roy Smalley, Jr., name under "In Memoriam" here was October 25.

We've lost a few players born in or close to 1952 already. Mike Flanagan, born in December 1951, was a recent one. Others who have died already include Darrell Porter and Glenn Burke (AIDS-related). I thought that Eddie Solomon, a pitcher who was killed in an auto accident at a fairly young age, was also born in 1952, but I don't see him on the 1952 births page here. He was probably born in one of the surrounding years, but I don't have time to check it right now.

Roy Smalley III, born October 25, 1952, was the first overall pick by the Texas Rangers in the January 1974 draft. I have never been able to figure out the purpose and qualifications for the January drafts and the supplemental drafts that were part of both the January and June drafts until the mid-1980s. Before signing with Texas at that point, he was picked in various drafts four times. He was traded to the Twins in the middle of the 1976 season.

That 1987 game 7 was his last game. It came during his second tour of duty with the Twins.

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By: RobMer http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-177946 Fri, 28 Oct 2011 01:17:51 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-177946 I had the same reaction when I came to B-R and simply saw "Roy Smalley Jr." as an entry, thinking "oh, no, he couldn't have died; he must be only in his 50s!"

While I can't say I was relieved to read it wasn't RSIII because it's still a death, it at least more understandable.

I always thought Roy Smalley Jr, err, the Third, might have had an easier time as a player if he came up a bit later. He came up as a SS during a time when SS's were supposed to be smaller guys, pesky hitters and slick fielders. Smalley was none of those, and seemed to bounce around between SS, 3B, DH and bench. Having a bigger man who had some pop at SS seemed to become more acceptable well into Ripken's career a decade after Smalley first came up.

Condolances to the Smalley family.

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By: howard rosen http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-177878 Thu, 27 Oct 2011 22:54:40 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-177878 @7...Smalley's regression was even worse than that, Ed. The first half split you posted was actually all games pre-all-star break which was 89 games. His stats for just the first 81 games were .362/.441/.576. Pretty amazing that he played in all 162 games while batting around .160 for the entire second half.

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By: Richard Chester http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-177825 Thu, 27 Oct 2011 20:38:49 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-177825 @11
Those 51 errors are the most in a season by a a SS since 1946.

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By: birtelcom http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-177753 Thu, 27 Oct 2011 18:11:01 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-177753 The name Roy Smalley triggers for me memories of "The Hidden Game of Baseball" (THGB) by John Thorn and Pete Palmer from 1984, which further explored the fresh approach to baseball analysis Bill James Abstracts were presenting at the time but was somewhat more systematic than Bill . THGB included an early form of uberstat (trailblazing for the later Win Shares, WARP, WAR, etc.) that suggested that Smalley III, who was in mid-career at the time, was one of the most valuable defensive players ever and as a result was an enormously valuable overall player. Though the theoretical analysis in THGB was mostly splendid, the Smalley evaluation, like some others in the book, seemed odd then and has not stood the test of time.

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By: BSK http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/16067/comment-page-1#comment-177744 Thu, 27 Oct 2011 17:41:15 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=16067#comment-177744 I used to make the same mistake with the John Thompsons, at G-Town. I always wondered why the called the father "junior". He was the junior. His son was the third. The original was not a coach.

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