Comments on: Top strike-throwers in 2011 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916 This and that about baseball stats. Tue, 16 Jul 2013 17:01:55 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.6 By: Splint http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109758 Tue, 03 May 2011 15:27:10 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109758 I was also wondering if there was a way to search for a team that saw knuckleballers in back to back games. I wonder if the second knuckleballer saw a marked decrease in effectiveness. Though I can't imagine it happened enough times to be significant.

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By: Andy http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109728 Tue, 03 May 2011 12:02:59 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109728 That's a good point, Splint. Anybody on the fringe in terms of technique may benefit from the general population's unfamiliarity, but that advantage rapidly declines as the technique's frequency increases.

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By: Splint http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109727 Tue, 03 May 2011 11:40:03 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109727 I always figured knuckleballes benefitted at least somewhat from their rarity and change of pace aspect. I'd wonder if more knuckleballers would hurt their effectiveness.

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By: John Autin http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109664 Tue, 03 May 2011 03:19:06 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109664 Johnny T -- Your points are entirely valid. But I also don't get any sense that teams are seeking those Jedi masters. I've never heard of a knuckleball academy or any sort of organizational effort to harness the power of that (admittedly difficult) pitch.

Since conventional pitching talent is more expensive than it's ever been, and teams feel they need more quality pitchers than ever before, it seems odd that no club is making a concerted effort to tap a resource that (a) can make a successful MLB pitcher without a 95-mph fastball, and (b) can enable that pitcher to throw more innings per season than a conventional pitcher.

P.S. on Dickey -- According to various sources, Dickey didn't start working on the knuckler in earnest until the 2005 season. Five years later, he had a very good year in MLB; he was 12th among 92 qualifiers with a 138 ERA+, and his 235 IP in MLB and AAA combined was topped by just 3 MLB pitchers. Five years doesn't seem like such a long development period for that kind of payoff.

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By: Johnny Twisto http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109613 Mon, 02 May 2011 20:57:25 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109613 It's a hard pitch to throw. You still have to be able to get guys out. Charlie Zink stalled out in the high minors. Charlie Haeger was horrible for LA last season. RA Dickey took many years to now (apparently) find a groove. You might say that more pitchers should be taught the knuckler, but there aren't that many Jedi masters around to pass on the secrets.

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By: John Autin http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109582 Mon, 02 May 2011 18:22:23 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109582 @23, Nash Bruce -- I'm with you!

One thing in particular I don't understand: With the average starting pitcher throwing fewer innings every year, and with all the hand-wringing concern about not abusing young arms, why aren't there more knuckleballers in the majors?

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By: Dave http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109536 Mon, 02 May 2011 13:49:09 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109536 @19..."right down the..." what??

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By: Nash Bruce http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109505 Mon, 02 May 2011 10:17:53 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109505 @ 20: Knuckleballers Rule!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :-DDDD
(not that I am one, or even a player, but still......love 'em*smiles*)

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By: flyingelbowsmash http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109464 Mon, 02 May 2011 02:19:38 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109464 Pitchers intentionally throw outside the strike zone to get "strikes." If a major league hitter (I know people like to say, so and so sucks, but any of these guys who make a MLB club are amazing) swings at a pitch, he thought it was going to be in the zone but was fooled by an equally amazing athlete on the mound. If you can throw pitches out of the strike zone and get hitters to swing and miss them, you are just a good as a guy who can throw pitches in the zone and still get hitters to miss them.
The same also applies to a foul ball that is crushed so hard it actually goes out of the stadium - its a strike.

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By: Will S http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/10916/comment-page-1#comment-109429 Mon, 02 May 2011 00:02:31 +0000 http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/?p=10916#comment-109429 I'm assuming no one took Chuck seriously, but just in case: People don't chart PitchFX data. Cameras do. Batted ball data is done by people.

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