You Are Here > Baseball-Reference.com > Blog >

SITE NEWS: We are moving all of our site and company news into a single blog for Sports-Reference.com. We'll tag all B-R content, so you can quickly and easily find the content you want.

Also, our existing B-R blog rss feed will be redirected to the new site's feed.

Baseball-Reference.com » Sports Reference

For more from Andy and the gang, check out their new site High Heat Stats.

All-Dominican Team

Posted by Neil Paine on April 30, 2011

The Dominican Republic has given us many great ballplayers over the years, far more than you might expect from a nation of its size. In fact, the tiny coastal town of San Pedro de Macorís alone has produced more MLB players per capita than any other municipality in the world. Baseball is so deeply ingrained in the culture of the D.R. that Pedro Gonzalez once said, "Every boy grows up with a bat and a ball—it’s the first present a male baby gets in his crib."

So, as a tribute to the fine baseball being played by its natives, here is the all-time Dominican all-star team according to Wins Above Replacement:

Catcher

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS
1 Tony Pena 18.7 1980 1997 1988 6489 667 1687 298 27 107 708 455 80 63 .260 .309 .364 .673 Monte Cristi, D.R.
2 Miguel Olivo 6.0 2002 2011 887 2950 355 725 144 24 112 395 130 44 25 .246 .283 .425 .707 Villa Vasquez, D.R.
3 Tony Eusebio 4.5 1991 2001 598 1739 179 479 87 5 30 241 182 1 5 .275 .346 .383 .729 Los Llanos, D.R.
4 Ronny Paulino 4.1 2005 2010 475 1576 157 431 77 1 31 192 129 4 2 .273 .328 .383 .711 Santo Domingo, D.R.
5 Carlos Santana 2.4 2010 2011 68 228 33 54 15 0 9 34 51 3 1 .237 .372 .421 .793 Santo Domingo, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

1st Base

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS
1 Albert Pujols 84.2 2001 2011 1583 5830 1206 1925 427 15 415 1248 924 77 34 .330 .424 .622 1.046 Santo Domingo, D.R.
2 Carlos Pena 12.2 2001 2011 1094 3683 561 881 172 20 230 655 594 23 14 .239 .350 .484 .834 Santo Domingo, D.R.
3 Domingo Martinez 0.3 1992 1993 15 22 4 9 0 0 2 6 1 0 0 .409 .435 .682 1.117 Santo Domingo, D.R.
4 Luis de los Santos -0.7 1988 1991 55 139 8 29 6 2 0 7 11 0 0 .209 .267 .281 .547 San Cristobal, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

2nd Base

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS
1 Placido Polanco 34.8 1998 2011 1621 6160 918 1873 312 32 98 647 356 79 30 .304 .348 .413 .761 Santo Domingo, D.R.
2 Robinson Cano 24.8 2005 2011 916 3572 523 1103 247 20 122 522 187 21 23 .309 .346 .492 .837 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
3 Luis Castillo 24.5 1996 2010 1720 6510 1001 1889 194 59 28 443 800 370 142 .290 .368 .351 .719 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
4 Alfonso Soriano 22.1 1999 2011 1492 5992 940 1654 377 27 321 855 386 262 72 .276 .325 .509 .834 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
5 Juan Samuel 13.6 1983 1998 1720 6081 873 1578 287 102 161 703 440 396 143 .259 .315 .420 .735 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

Shortstop

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS
1 Miguel Tejada 41.6 1997 2011 2049 8037 1192 2302 452 23 301 1265 540 80 35 .286 .338 .461 .799 Bani, D.R.
2 Tony Fernandez 39.6 1983 2001 2158 7911 1057 2276 414 92 94 844 690 246 138 .288 .347 .399 .746 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
3 Rafael Furcal 31.6 2000 2011 1404 5658 950 1613 279 65 100 510 571 294 86 .285 .350 .410 .761 Loma de Cabrera, D.R.
4 Hanley Ramirez 28.9 2005 2011 781 3058 569 949 202 24 124 396 336 199 62 .310 .383 .514 .896 Samana, D.R.
5 Jose Reyes 24.0 2003 2011 949 4025 652 1154 199 85 75 386 297 339 87 .287 .336 .434 .770 Villa Gonzalez, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

3rd Base

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS
1 Adrian Beltre 43.8 1998 2011 1860 6969 928 1914 402 28 285 1029 521 113 40 .275 .328 .463 .791 Santo Domingo, D.R.
2 Aramis Ramirez 22.2 1998 2011 1557 5814 800 1642 344 18 290 1038 467 15 14 .282 .341 .497 .838 Santo Domingo, D.R.
3 Tony Batista 12.5 1996 2007 1309 4568 625 1146 226 17 221 718 287 47 26 .251 .299 .453 .752 Puerto Plata, D.R.
4 Fernando Tatis 7.2 1997 2010 949 3051 427 807 174 14 113 448 321 50 21 .265 .344 .442 .785 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
5 Pedro Feliz 5.1 2000 2010 1302 4254 487 1065 209 25 140 598 230 13 12 .250 .288 .410 .698 Azua, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

Outfield

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS Pos
1 Manny Ramirez 67.1 1993 2011 2302 8244 1544 2574 547 20 555 1831 1329 38 33 .312 .411 .585 .996 79D Santo Domingo, D.R.
2 Sammy Sosa 59.7 1989 2007 2354 8813 1475 2408 379 45 609 1667 929 234 107 .273 .344 .534 .878 *98D/7 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
3 Vladimir Guerrero 59.2 1996 2011 2025 7688 1277 2454 449 45 440 1444 720 179 92 .319 .382 .561 .943 *9D/87 Nizao, D.R.
4 Cesar Cedeno 52.2 1970 1986 2006 7310 1084 2087 436 60 199 976 664 550 179 .285 .347 .443 .790 *8397/5 Santo Domingo, D.R.
5 Felipe Alou 39.4 1958 1974 2082 7339 985 2101 359 49 206 852 423 107 67 .286 .328 .433 .761 9837/56 Haina, D.R.
6 Raul Mondesi 27.2 1993 2005 1525 5814 909 1589 319 49 271 860 475 229 92 .273 .331 .485 .815 *98/7D San Cristobal, D.R.
7 Stan Javier 24.8 1984 2001 1763 5047 781 1358 225 40 57 503 578 246 51 .269 .345 .363 .708 897/3D45 San Francisco de Macoris, D.R.
8 Matty Alou 20.5 1960 1974 1667 5789 780 1777 236 50 31 427 311 156 80 .307 .345 .381 .726 *8973/1 Haina, D.R.
9 George Bell 18.2 1981 1993 1587 6123 814 1702 308 34 265 1002 331 67 36 .278 .316 .469 .785 *7D9/54 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
10 Manny Mota 16.7 1962 1982 1536 3779 496 1149 125 52 31 438 289 50 42 .304 .355 .389 .744 789/542 Santo Domingo, D.R.
11 Cesar Geronimo 10.7 1969 1983 1522 3780 460 977 161 50 51 392 354 82 40 .258 .325 .368 .693 *89/73 El Seibo, D.R.
12 Nelson Cruz 8.2 2005 2011 437 1503 217 408 82 7 83 251 146 44 14 .271 .336 .501 .837 *9/7D8 Monte Cristi, D.R.
13 Luis Polonia 6.6 1987 2000 1379 4840 728 1417 189 70 36 405 369 321 145 .293 .342 .383 .726 *7D/89 Santiago, D.R.
14 Felix Jose 5.8 1988 2003 747 2527 322 708 135 14 54 324 203 102 57 .280 .334 .409 .743 *9/78D Santo Domingo, D.R.
15 Willy Taveras 5.8 2004 2010 670 2412 358 662 71 16 8 128 136 195 44 .274 .320 .327 .647 *8/97D Tenares, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

Designated Hitter

Rk Player WAR/pos From To G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SB CS BA OBP SLG OPS
1 David Ortiz 31.1 1997 2011 1619 5768 988 1620 419 16 351 1180 892 10 6 .281 .377 .542 .918 Santo Domingo, D.R.
2 Carlos Casimiro -0.1 2000 2000 2 8 0 1 1 0 0 3 0 0 0 .125 .125 .250 .375 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

Starting Pitchers

Rk Player WAR From To G GS W L W-L% SV IP H R BB SO ERA ERA+ HR
1 Pedro Martinez 75.9 1992 2009 476 409 219 100 .687 3 2827.1 2221 1006 760 3154 2.93 154 239 Manoguayabo, D.R.
2 Juan Marichal 64.0 1960 1975 471 457 243 142 .631 2 3507.0 3153 1329 709 2303 2.89 123 320 Laguna Verde, D.R.
3 Bartolo Colon 32.9 1997 2011 333 327 155 104 .598 0 2102.2 2091 1040 716 1633 4.08 113 258 Altamira, D.R.
4 Jose Rijo 31.0 1984 2002 376 269 116 91 .560 3 1880.0 1710 772 663 1606 3.24 121 147 San Cristobal, D.R.
5 Mario Soto 26.9 1977 1988 297 224 100 92 .521 4 1730.1 1395 732 657 1449 3.47 108 172 Bani, D.R.
6 Ramon Martinez 25.8 1988 2001 301 297 135 88 .605 0 1895.2 1691 880 795 1427 3.67 106 170 Santo Domingo, D.R.
7 Pedro Astacio 25.7 1992 2006 392 343 129 124 .510 0 2196.2 2292 1213 726 1664 4.67 98 291 Hato Mayor, D.R.
8 Juan Guzman 23.1 1991 2000 240 240 91 79 .535 0 1483.1 1360 750 667 1243 4.08 112 149 Santo Domingo, D.R.
9 Pascual Perez 18.1 1980 1991 207 193 67 68 .496 0 1244.1 1167 541 344 822 3.44 110 107 San Cristobal, D.R.
10 Joaquin Andujar 16.9 1976 1988 405 305 127 118 .518 9 2153.0 2016 955 731 1032 3.58 99 155 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
11 Jose DeLeon 16.4 1983 1995 415 264 86 119 .420 6 1897.1 1556 877 841 1594 3.76 102 153 Rancho Viejo, D.R.
12 Ubaldo Jimenez 15.4 2006 2011 120 119 50 37 .575 0 744.0 618 320 327 669 3.59 131 48 Nagua, D.R.
13 Ervin Santana 12.5 2005 2011 178 175 76 58 .567 0 1101.2 1110 578 350 884 4.43 98 141 La Romana, D.R.
14 Melido Perez 9.4 1987 1995 243 201 78 85 .479 1 1354.2 1268 700 551 1092 4.17 98 144 San Cristobal, D.R.
15 Odalis Perez 9.0 1998 2008 252 221 73 82 .471 0 1335.0 1409 704 388 920 4.46 95 162 Las Matas de Farfan, D.R.
16 Wandy Rodriguez 7.8 2005 2011 181 172 63 67 .485 0 1015.0 1018 535 362 865 4.22 99 113 Santiago Rodriguez, D.R.
17 Francisco Liriano 7.5 2005 2011 113 94 39 36 .520 1 572.2 540 280 212 585 4.18 103 54 San Cristobal, D.R.
18 Fausto Carmona 6.1 2006 2011 155 124 48 54 .471 0 782.2 801 421 317 479 4.46 95 69 Santo Domingo, D.R.
19 Daniel Cabrera 5.5 2004 2009 162 155 48 65 .425 1 892.1 884 548 520 674 5.10 88 92 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
20 Carlos Perez 4.6 1995 2000 142 127 40 53 .430 0 822.2 900 451 211 448 4.44 95 108 Nigua, D.R.
21 Johnny Cueto 4.0 2008 2010 92 92 32 32 .500 0 531.0 531 270 185 428 4.27 98 72 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
22 Edinson Volquez 3.9 2005 2011 79 75 30 23 .566 0 416.2 397 225 221 406 4.49 97 47 Santo Domingo, D.R.
23 Ramon Ortiz 3.3 1999 2010 274 212 85 82 .509 0 1389.2 1501 824 478 862 4.93 91 222 Cotui, D.R.
24 Jose Lima 3.2 1994 2006 348 235 89 102 .466 5 1567.2 1783 972 393 980 5.26 85 267 Santiago, D.R.
25 Nino Espinosa 3.1 1974 1981 140 126 44 55 .444 0 820.1 865 414 252 338 4.17 88 85 Villa Altagracia, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

Relief Pitchers

Rk Player WAR From To G GF W L W-L% SV IP H R BB SO ERA ERA+ HR
1 Francisco Cordero 19.5 1999 2011 695 504 39 42 .481 294 725.2 646 289 339 730 3.22 144 50 Santo Domingo, D.R.
2 Armando Benitez 17.8 1994 2008 762 527 40 47 .460 289 779.0 545 296 403 946 3.13 140 95 Ramon Santana, D.R.
3 Alejandro Pena 15.1 1981 1996 503 232 56 52 .519 74 1057.2 959 427 331 839 3.11 119 75 Cambiaso, D.R.
4 Octavio Dotel 14.3 1999 2011 638 269 50 44 .532 105 842.0 674 382 384 1023 3.76 121 110 Santo Domingo, D.R.
5 Jose Mesa 11.4 1987 2007 1022 633 80 109 .423 321 1548.2 1629 811 651 1038 4.36 101 151 Pueblo Viejo, D.R.
6 Jose Valverde 10.2 2003 2011 450 362 23 23 .500 198 459.2 345 173 189 542 3.09 144 50 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
7 Carlos Marmol 9.4 2006 2011 327 138 17 20 .459 66 397.0 243 150 259 516 3.22 141 30 Bonao, D.R.
8 Rafael Soriano 9.4 2002 2011 353 174 12 21 .364 89 405.1 289 136 126 429 2.86 149 40 San Jose, D.R.
9 Damaso Marte 9.0 1999 2010 570 137 23 27 .460 36 503.2 405 209 229 533 3.48 131 48 Santo Domingo, D.R.
10 Elias Sosa 8.4 1972 1983 601 330 59 51 .536 83 918.0 873 388 334 538 3.32 112 64 La Vega, D.R.
11 Joaquin Benoit 8.3 2001 2011 347 66 31 28 .525 9 661.2 593 349 295 619 4.45 106 83 Santiago, D.R.
12 Hector Carrasco 7.8 1994 2007 647 207 44 50 .468 19 832.1 792 411 387 662 4.00 113 69 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
13 Felix Rodriguez 6.6 1995 2006 563 167 38 26 .594 11 586.1 526 256 283 512 3.71 113 50 Monte Cristi, D.R.
14 Victor Cruz 6.2 1978 1983 187 128 18 23 .439 37 271.0 218 104 131 248 3.09 132 28 Rancho Viejo, D.R.
15 Mel Rojas 6.1 1990 1999 525 282 34 31 .523 126 667.0 591 305 254 562 3.82 107 65 Haina, D.R.
16 Hipolito Pichardo 5.9 1992 2002 350 103 50 44 .532 20 769.2 838 425 287 394 4.44 105 54 Esperanza, D.R.
17 Cecilio Guante 5.6 1982 1990 363 164 29 34 .460 35 595.0 512 256 236 503 3.48 111 61 Villa Mella, D.R.
18 Ramon Ramirez 5.5 2006 2011 306 77 18 14 .563 5 309.2 256 119 126 253 3.20 143 23 Puerto Plata, D.R.
19 Bill Castro 5.1 1974 1983 303 198 31 26 .544 45 546.1 564 245 145 203 3.33 118 36 Santiago, D.R.
20 Alberto Reyes 4.8 1995 2008 384 150 23 16 .590 32 428.2 340 190 195 422 3.82 118 53 San Cristobal, D.R.
21 Frank Francisco 4.7 2004 2011 281 108 18 15 .545 32 287.2 239 125 129 321 3.72 124 28 Santo Domingo, D.R.
22 Salomon Torres 4.6 1993 2008 497 168 44 58 .431 57 847.1 857 446 349 540 4.31 101 91 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
23 Antonio Alfonseca 4.5 1997 2007 592 301 35 37 .486 129 613.0 677 296 250 400 4.11 104 55 La Romana, D.R.
24 Guillermo Mota 4.4 1999 2011 676 198 38 42 .475 9 772.1 682 354 295 613 3.89 108 79 San Pedro de Macoris, D.R.
25 Neftali Feliz 3.9 2009 2011 98 70 5 3 .625 47 108.2 60 28 31 116 2.32 191 7 Azua, D.R.
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 4/30/2011.

I think this team would be extremely difficult to beat (ordering the lineup according to The Book):

1. OF Manny Ramirez (.312/.411/.585)
2. OF Vladimir Guerrero (.319/.382/.561)
3. OF Sammy Sosa (.273/.344/.534)
4. 1B Albert Pujols (.330/.424/.622)
5. DH David Ortiz (.281/.377/.542)
6. SS Miguel Tejada (.286/.338/.461)
7. 3B Adrian Beltre (.275/.328/.463)
8. C Tony Pena  (.260/.309/.364)
9. 2B Placido Polanco (.304/.348/.413)

1. Pedro Martinez - 219-100 (.687), 2.93 ERA
2. Juan Marichal - 243-142 (.631), 2.89 ERA
3. Bartolo Colon - 155-104 (.598), 4.08 ERA
4. Jose Rijo - 116-91 (.560), 3.24 ERA
5. Mario Soto - 100-92 (.521), 3.47 ERA
CL Francisco Cordero - 294 SV, 3.22 ERA

This entry was posted on Saturday, April 30th, 2011 at 4:59 am and is filed under History, Play Index, WAR. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

54 Responses to “All-Dominican Team”

  1. Nash Bruce Says:

    WOW. One town, not one country, or one region, even, but one TOWN, kicking the entire, ENTIRE planet Earth's A**.........WOW.

  2. Nash Bruce Says:

    *Earths.............sry:(

  3. Thomas Court Says:

    Cano will make the team even better when he passes Polanco.

    This team does have an Achilles heal: On Base Percentage. This team is loaded with free swingers. To defeat this team, you need a pitcher with command of the strike zone. A Greg Maddux type, who can take advantage of the fact that many of these players live by the premise: "You cannot walk off the island."

  4. Nash Bruce Says:

    @3: I hear what you're saying, and agree. However, I think, that any team, that had Greg Maddux,would have a good shot at winning, regardless of WHO their opponent was, nevermind WHAT kind of team, their opponent was.....:)

  5. Any info on how Domingo Martinez managed to retire with a .409 avg. over 2 seasons?

    I know it was only a 22 at bat sample, but you'd think he'd find a way to get some playing time somewhere? Or did he just get injured and never recover?

    I wonder what's the most PA's any player had in their career since 1970 managing to finish with a career .400 avg.

  6. Also, a lot of players implicated with steroids on that list. Ramirez/Sosa/Ortiz/Tejada.

  7. Thomas Court Says:

    Sosa, Manny, Ortiz, Tejada...

    This team might run into trouble playing in a league that had drug testing. They also don't have much speed top to bottom. The starting nine hitters only combine for 890 career stolen bases. A team with Rickey Henderson already has 516 more steals in the leadoff position than the whole DR team combined.

    It would be interesting though to see how they would compare to a team of US only players, or perhaps even a team of California born players.

    A Calfornian only team has:
    1B - Mark Mcguire
    2B - Jeff Kent or Joe Gordon (HOF)
    3B - Darrell Evans
    SS - Nomar Garciaparra
    C - Gary Carter (HOF)
    OF - Barry Bonds
    OF - Joe Dimaggio (HOF)
    OF - Ted Williams (HOF)
    DH - Eddie Murray (HOF)

    SP - Tom Seaver (HOF)
    SP - Randy Johnson
    SP - Don Drysedale (HOF)
    SP - Bob Lemon (HOF)
    SP - Lefty Gomez (HOF) or CC Sabathia or David Wells
    CL - Dennis Eckersley (HOF) or Trevor Hoffman (I have to go with Eck here)

  8. Oops, all the answers about Martinez here....weight problems, poor fielding, and his best years played in Japan/Mexico.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domingo_Mart%C3%ADnez

  9. I'd put Cedeno in center field, even if it meant giving up Vlad's or Sosa's bat.

  10. Where is Pedro Guerero? He was from the D.R.

  11. #10 - I see the problem with Guerrero -- I have the positional searches set to pick up guys who played >=50% of their games at that position, and Guerrero didn't play any single position that much. If we consider him a 1B, with 35.1 WAR he'd be 2nd, way behind Albert. If he's in the OF, he'd be right behind Felipe Alou at #6. Peak-wise, though, Guerrero was a great player.

  12. Let's not forget why the OBP is so poor. The old saying goes: "You can't walk off the island."

  13. #9 - Yeah, you'd probably have to end up doing that. But Sosa actually played 25 games at CF in 1999 and was at +4 runs/yr, so you could at least give him a look out there.

  14. Thomas Court Says:

    @12

    Apparently you forgot that I mentioned that quote in response #3. LoL

  15. Thomas Court Says:

    You can make some really good teams with players from Ohio, Alabama, New York or Pennsylvania. But the aforementioned team from California comes out on top. Tony Gwynn, Duke Snider, Harry Heilmann, Harry Hooper, Joe Cronin, Bobby Doerr, Tony Lazzeri, and Ernie Lombardi are all Hall of Famers from California who didn't even make the team I put together.

  16. @1,2 - I'm gonna be That Guy. You had it right the first time ("Earth's"). There is only one Earth.

  17. Frank Clingenpeel Says:

    And to manage this outfit -- Felipe Alou'

  18. Francisco Says:

    #7 Sosa, Manny, Ortiz, Tejada...

    Mcgwire, Bonds …

    California is almost 9 times bigger than DR and has 4 times DR population. Besides drugs implications, there is the color integration. The first Dominican player to play in MLB was Ozzie Virgil in 1956. There are some remarkable cases of players from DR that had been stars, like Tetelo Vargas or Diómedes Olivo. The last one arrived the big leagues being 41 years old in 1960. In fact, the color integration promoted the organization of the professional league in DR in 1951, and the need of becoming a winter league, instead of a summer one, in 1955.

    It’s true, the team has a low OBP. And it isn’t so fast, but it’s a lot faster that that Californian team.

  19. Spartan Bill Says:

    Should Pujols and Man-Ram be on a true Dominican list?

    Sure they were born there, but both grew up in the United States.

  20. Spartan Bill Says:

    The talent level here further emphasizes why players from the D-R should be included in the annual draft.

  21. @3..

    Whoops, sorry. Mr. Court.

  22. #19 Pujols went to USA when he was 16. It's a Dominican born list. Or maybe we must include Moisés who has made his life in DR. Or we can exclude those Californians who moved from that state for the Californian team. Or we can make a Dominican Citizens team where we can legally include A-Rod. Multiple Vantage points.

    #20 The talent level is not the main reason for including a location in the annual draft.We have the case of Puerto Rico where its representation has diminished since PR was included in the draft. The problem with Latin locations is the organization. The way of a boy from USA reaching MLB is studying. The way of a Dominican boy maybe is quitting studying. There’s not a correlation between studying and being a sport athlete there.

  23. The problem with this team's OBP is being overstated -walks alone don't mean a player is good at getting on base. Vlad, Tejada, and Polanco all had high career BABIP, not because of luck, but because of high line drive rates. I'd rather take my chances with guys like that against a good pitcher than a low average/high OBP, high strikeout guy like Jason Giambi or Jim Thome, who could be waiting around for a perfect pitch they never get.

    Against lefties, Cedeno would have to be in CF, while Manny or Sosa would DH.

    I'm not surprised Beltre is ahead of Aramis Ramirez among 3B, but I would not have expected the gap to be so significant.

  24. Spartan Bill Says:

    @ 22 The studying issue is exactly why the under-developed nations meed the draft.

    Sure Pedro Martinez, and Vlad Guerrero made it without an education, but what about all those guys who hit .208 in A-ball and are never heard from again?

  25. Jaded Salinger Says:

    Mobile, Alabama (which is actually smaller than San Pedro de Macoris as of 2000) looks pretty good for a city its size (number listed next to names is career WAR):

    C - Bob Henley - 1.2
    1B - Willie McCovey - 65.1
    2B - Frank Bolling - 13.3
    SS - Ozzie Smith - 64.6
    3B - Jimmy Sexton - 0.4
    LF - Juan Pierre - 13.3
    CF - Amos Otis - 40.4
    RF - Hank Aaron - 141.6

    SP - Don Sutton - 70.8
    SP - Early Wynn - 52.0
    SP - Jimmy Key - 45.7
    SP - Virgil Trucks - 41.6
    SP - Doyle Alexander - 31.9
    Closer - Clay Caroll - 16.9

    Also worth noting that at least one HOF was left off, Satchel Paige.

  26. John Autin Says:

    I think the "50%" setting also filtered out Julio Franco (40.6 WAR). His games were divided somewhat evenly among SS, 2B and 1B. At 2B, he would rank #1 in WAR, almost 6 WAR above Polanco.

    Also filtered out:
    -- Rico Carty (OF/DH, 31.4 WAR). He would rank 5th as an OF.

    BTW, I'm not criticizing; it's hard to target a P-I search for specific positions without unintentionally excluding some players based on the % setting.

  27. John Autin Says:

    Some players manage long careers without quite denting the WAR leaders:

    -- SS Alfredo Griffin: 1,962 G; 7,330 PA; -2.4 WAR.

  28. Thomas Court Says:

    @18

    I was just amazed at the amount of talent to come out of California. I was also surprised at the lack of speed on the basepaths on the DR team. Averaging less than 100 SB per position over an entire career is hard to accomplish with such a talented list of players. Cedeno would help that, and so would adding Hanley Ramirez to replace Tejada (also nearly a 100 point OPS bump). I also forgot to include the fact that California also has its steroid skeletons as well (they get them from BALCO and from those muscle junkies on the beach). But you can't edit posts once they are submitted (something I wish we could do, if only to korrect myy occasional spelling miztakes).

    But the talent from Cali is so deep that you can exclude the steroid users, and add some speed as well and still have a great team:

    1B - Keith Hernandez (now we have cocaine instead of steroids)
    2B - Joe Gordon (HOF) or Steve Sax (444 SB)
    3B - Darrell Evans
    SS - Alan Trammell (236 SB)
    C - Gary Carter (HOF)
    OF - Tony Gwynn (HOF) 319 SB
    OF - Joe Dimaggio (HOF)
    OF - Ted Williams (HOF)
    DH - Eddie Murray (HOF) or Duke Snider (HOF) if Murray was secretly on 'roids

    SP - Tom Seaver (HOF)
    SP - Randy Johnson
    SP - Don Drysedale (HOF)
    SP - Bob Lemon (HOF)
    SP - Lefty Gomez (HOF)
    CL - Dennis Eckersley (HOF) or Trevor Hoffman (I have to go with Eck here)

    This team has up to 11 Hall of Famers and will have 12 when RJ is elected. It is also steroid free (unless Gwynn, Murray or RJ were juicing and escaped detection). There is still the integration point that was made, but this thread is about "Where" players are from... not "When" they are from. "When" they are from also effects William's and Dimaggio's numbers because of WWII and Korea.

  29. Nash Bruce Says:

    @23: the value of swinging the bat, (versus how Ryan Howard, 'ended' last year's NLCS, holding his) I agree....
    Tony Gwynn comes to mind, as someone who didn't walk much, and certainly didn't wait around for the perfect strike to hit. But he hit Maddux very well, over a long career.
    @16: will keep guessing, until I get it right! ;)

  30. Holy middle infielders...wow.

  31. Johnny Twisto Says:

    Second base is interesting. Without checking the numbers, I think there's a reasonable argument that Cano, Soriano, Castillo, and possibly Samuel had better peaks than Polanco and could be the choice if not going by career WAR.

    Harking back to a recent discussion, if the actual starting roster was as shown above, is there any doubt that Polanco would be batting 2nd, or possibly 1st?

    (FWIW, I have no problem with Polanco and think he is a good player. He's just an example of things I've been pointing out so it may appear I've been ripping him lately.)

  32. I see Stan Javier on the list. Where did his Dad, Julian rank? He had some good years at second base with the Cardinals.

  33. John Autin Says:

    @32, Steven -- Although Julian Javier played 13 seasons (11 full), won two WS titles and was twice an All-Star, he is credited with just 9.4 total WAR, well out of the top 5 in Dominican second basemen.

    Julian Javier's offense was (I think) a little above average for the position, taking his career as a whole. But the WAR method sees him as a poor defender, charging him with -3.5 defensive WAR for his career.

  34. John Autin Says:

    @31, Johnny Twisto -- I rarely sing the praises of Placido Polanco, but WAR shows him as clearly better than Juan Samuel, even in peak value.

    Samuel's 3-year WAR peak (1985-87) averaged 2.9 WAR.
    Polanco's 3-year WAR peak (2006-08) averaged 3.3 WAR.

    And Polanco had 5 seasons with a higher WAR than Samuel's season high of 3.0.

    Samuel was considered to be a very poor defender, and WAR agrees; he averaged -1.1 dWAR for his first 6 full years (the Philly years). Offensively, he did have a lot of extra-base hits, but (a) he used a ton of outs to get them, and (b) he rarely walked, so his offensive value was less than it appeared at first glance.

  35. John Autin Says:

    Polanco's 3-year peak WAR (avg. 3.3) was also little higher than Alfonso Soriano's 3-year peak as a 2B (avg. 3.2).

    Soriano did average 3.8 WAR from 2006-08, but he was a full-time outfielder. BTW, with 93 more games in the OF, Soriano will have more career games in the OF than at 2B.

  36. [...] All-Dominican Team » Baseball-Reference Blog » Blog Archive [...]

  37. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    For such a team, I don't think Manny Ramirez should be on the list. Putting Manny Ramirez on the DR list is like putting Derek Jeter on the best players to come out of New Jersey list; or Bert Blyleven as the best player to come out of the Netherlands; Barack Obama the best president to be born in Hawaii; etc., etc. Though born there, they grew up in different systems (NY; MI; CA; Kenya respectively).

    Removing 'drafted' from the query would remove Ramirez and others who were the product of the US system.

  38. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    ... and Albert Pujols too...

  39. Francisco Says:

    #37 We've been get used to comments like this since Dec 5th 1492. If you remove drafted players you put Plácido out too. #38 Pujols have lived less than half of his life in USA. It's a better idea to include them in the USA team, except those who plays in Canadian teams. I don't know I just trying to read what you want to say.

    Let's wait WBC.

  40. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    @39: The argument is simple, and contains cultural implications: The opening of this post reads:

    "Baseball is so deeply ingrained in the culture of the D.R. that Pedro Gonzalez once said, "Every boy grows up with a bat and a ball—it’s the first present a male baby gets in his crib."

    If the point is to simply state that these are the best players who were thrust out of their mothers' wombs, via a natural thrust or the intervention of foreceps, in the DR then this is by all means accurate.

    If the point is to state these are the best players not only born, but cultivated in the DR baseball system then it's not accurate. Manny Ramirez was a star high school baseball player in NY. Dominican roots: yes; cultivated in the 'Dominican system': absolutely not.

    Albert Pujols initially may have suffered because he played in Missouri. He was a product of a MO system that is not considered by many, if anyone, to be a 'baseball factory'. His obvious talents may have been a partial product of his heritage, but his being drafted in the 13th was a direct result of the system in which his talents were initially cultivated.

    As for whatever was intended by your "Let's wait WBC" comment: Maybe you are mistaking one's heritage with where one grew up. I am not sure. I would be surprised if anyone thought Mike Piazza was even born, let alone reared, in Italy when he played for Italy in the WBC, but maybe you did.

  41. DoubleDiamond Says:

    I keep in my head a long list of major league players, including Blyleven, whose place of birth is not in California but who appear to have grown up there.

    Here are a few:

    Bert Blyleven (Netherlands)
    Rick Monday, Pat Burrell (both Arkansas)
    Robin Yount (Illinois) (and presumably his brother Larry, too)
    Ed Sprague, Sr. (Massachusetts)
    Andy Messersmith (New Jersey)
    Dave Duncan (Texas, which itself has such a list beginning in my brain, with Roger Clemens, among others)
    Aaron Rowand (Oregon)
    Bobby Grich (Michigan)
    Shawn Green (Illinois, with a stop in New Jersey along the way)

    There are a very few that have gone in reverse, including two who became Phillies closers:

    Brad Lidge (born in CA, appears to have grown up in Colorado)
    Mitch Williams (born in CA, appears to have grown up in Oregon)

  42. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    @41
    Probably the greatest player born in West Virgina, George Brett, grew up in California as well.

  43. John Autin Says:

    @40, NoChance -- You seem to have an extremely narrow view of what it means to be "cultivated in the Dominican system."

    Manny Ramirez was born in the D.R. in 1972. His family moved to the U.S. in 1985, which would make him 12 or 13. I submit that for at least 9 out of 10 baseball stars, the seeds of their future stardom have already grown deep roots by that age, and for Dominicans the numbers would be even higher.

    Furthermore, in case you didn't know, after leaving the D.R., Manny lived the remainder of his youth in the Washington Heights neighborhood of upper Manhattan, an area in which Hispanics (and particularly Dominicans) are predominant. I'm certain that the majority of the players and coaches with whom Manny was involved in amateur baseball in the U.S. had Dominican origins.

    The fact that George Washington High School, where Manny developed into a baseball prodigy, had an excellent baseball program is, I think, more a statement about "the Dominican system" than about our own. There aren't a lot of high-caliber baseball programs in the NYC high schools. The ones that do exist are almost all driven by Latinos.

    There might be some reason to deny Manny a place on our imaginary All-Dominican team, but the fact that he went to H.S. in the States isn't it.

  44. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    @40: John, you're right. I just checked all the great hitters and pitchers that played with me in little league when I was 12 and 13... they were all drafted by MLB teams. Sorry for the confusion. I also just verified that Roy Halladay was actually born Danny Almonte...

    Your statement about GW High School is in fact an argument for my argument. The fact that there was a strong program, and strong coaches, possibly less corruption and different opportunities inherently available in the US than in the DR definitely had nothing to do with Manny Ramirez's success.

    By your argument, Facebook is a product of the White Plains, NY school system. Though Mark Zuckerberg's talents (whether it is a talent for stealing other's ideas or other) were cultivated at Harvard and later Palo Alto, CA I guess means nothing because he turned his first computer on in White Plains, NY.

    Success is usually about opportunity, not heritage and not where you lived until you were 12 or 13. If you think that Manny Ramirez got his opportunity to be a top flight player in the DR at the age of 9... well... then, again you win the argument.

  45. DoubleDiamond Says:

    Over the years, I've tended to place foreign-born players into three categories:

    1. Players who were born to American parents (or one American parent and one non-American parent, such as Danny Graves) while they (the parents) were living outside the U.S. but did most of their growing up in the U.S. or on U.S. military bases overseas. Other examples include Steve Jeltz and Dave Roberts (the one who was with the Red Sox in 2004).

    2. Players who were born outside the U.S. to non-American parents who were brought to the U.S.as a child and signed their first professional contract while living in the U.S. There were a number of such players in the 19th century and in the first half of the 20th century who were born in Europe. Examples include Bobby Thomson, Moe Drabowsky, Bert Blyleven, Manny Ramirez, Albert Pujols, and Jose Canseco (and his twin brother Ozzie).

    3. Players who were born outside the U.S. who did all of their growing up outside the U.S. and either signed their first professional contract or were recruited to play in a U.S.-based college baseball program while living outside the U.S. or after defecting to the U.S.

    There are a few complicating factors, such as how do I classify Canadians, Puerto Ricans, and players from other U.S. territories?

    Where would Reno Bertoia have been placed? He was born in Italy and brought to Canada as a young child. I would tend to put him into category #2.

    What about Rafael Palmeiro, a Puerto Rican who came to the U.S. to play college baseball? I would tend to put him into category #3.

    Now that foreign adoptions are fairly common, in which category would a child born overseas but adopted at a very young age by an American couple fit? I would tend to put him into category #1 because of the American parents aspect. I don't know of any major leaguers who were adopted in such circumstances. (Jim Bouton adopted a son from Korea. Based on what I read about him in "Ball Four" and/or a subsequent book, possibly including his ex-wife's "tell all" book written with pitcher Mike Marshall's ex-wife, this son was more interested in playing hockey than baseball.)

  46. John Autin Says:

    NoChance, if you weren't so quick to sarcasm, you might have a better chance to understand what I said -- or at least not to misrepresent it in paraphrase.

    Your opening line makes no sense; it certainly isn't a logical reply to anything that I said. As for the rest of your argument, I don't get it, and I'll leave it at that.

  47. John Autin Says:

    Here's my argument that, by any reasonable understanding of the term "product," Manny Ramirez is a product of the Dominican Republic.

    (1) Manny was born in the Dominican Republic and lived there until the age of 12 or 13.

    (2) Baseball is extremely popular in the D.R., and playing baseball is a primary recreation activity of most Dominican boys.

    (3) Thus, it is very likely that Manny played a lot of baseball before he moved to the U.S. -- more than most American boys who wind up in MLB.

    (4) Playing a lot of baseball as a child greatly improves one's chances of becoming a MLB player.

    (5) It is likely that Manny Ramirez's ambition to become a MLB player was formed while he still lived in the D.R., and this ambition shaped his behavior after he came to the U.S.

    (6) The great majority of Dominicans who make it to the major leagues have never lived outside the D.R. before signing a pro contract.

    (7) Although Manny played in a good baseball program in the U.S., it is likely that, even if he had stayed in the D.R., a player of his talent up to age 12 would have continued to develop that talent through his teens, and likely would have been discovered and signed by a MLB team

    (8) If Manny had been born in the U.S., his odds of becoming a MLB player would have been lower. In terms of becoming a MLB player, the sum of the advantages he gained by living in the D.R. for his first 12 years outweighs the advantages he gained by living in the U.S. afterward.

  48. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    @45 comes up with an intelligent classification system which I agree with more or less.

    It's simple: Manny Ramirez did not come through the DR system. He came through the US system, which inclusive of PR and Canada, has strict rules regarding amateur athletes.

    Though one could argue that the US amateur system is flawed and rife with corruption (see Newton, Cam); it is inarguably less corrupt than that of Central and South American 'baseball academies'.

    Baseball is a way of life in the DR partly because it is a 'way out'. Because it is a 'way out', players in the DR are subject to, and victims of, extreme exploitation. That exploitation would exist here however is reduced significantly due to in place collective bargaining agreements (which include the amateur draft).

    Players are squirreled away in 'training academies' as young as 12-13 with no protection; players 'sign' with 'scouts' who's primary responsibility is to keep talent flowing to the MLB. Their responsibility is not to the player, but to maximize returns.

    Players are subject to, and victims of, significant amounts of fraud and exploitation primarily because 'baseball is a way out.' Steps have been taken to ensure violations are reduced, but these steps were introduced over the past few years only.

    You can ascribe to the pollyanna view that baseball is clean and pure and that boys in the Dominican Republic play for the love of the game and recreation. You can similarly say that reason lottery tickets sell better in lower income areas is because people in lower income brackets love games of chance more than those in higher income areas. Honestly, though, if you think this, you're delusional.

    Manny Ramirez, Carlos Pena, Albert Pujols, et al. were not subject to, or products of, the DR system (which MLB essentially dictates). They were born there, may have first fallen in love or lust with baseball there, but were not products of its system. They were products of the US system.

  49. John Autin Says:

    NoChance, this is what I still don't understand in your statements:

    You continue to cite, over and over again, corruption among D.R. scouts / agents / academies.

    Nobody is denying the existence of said corruption.

    What you have yet to do is to explain what how that corruption is relevant
    to the question of which country has a better claim to "producing" Manny Ramirez.

    I'm not asking whether Manny would have been more in danger of exploitation had he stayed in the D.R. I'm not asking whether he might have committed some kind of immigration violation, date-of-birth subterfuge, or other illegal act if he had stayed in the D.R. I'm not asking if he would have missed out on schooling if he had stayed in the D.R. (and by the way, he left George Washington High without graduating).

    What I'm asking is: If he had stayed in the D.R., would he still have developed into a talented hitter who signed with a MLB team? Would his MLB career arc have been significantly different?

    These are questions that I see as relevant to the question of which country "produced" Manny Ramirez.

  50. @45 Rafafel Palmeiro is not Puerto Rican, he is Cuban.

  51. TheGoof Says:

    Best outfield: the three guys of Donora, Pa. DR's not even close.

  52. @37

    Off-topic, but Obama didn't grow up in Kenya. He grew up in Hawaii and Indonesia and went to Kenya for the first time at the age of 26.

  53. NoChanceforPettitte Says:

    @52
    I know... was a bad joke... ill timed and ill-er conceived.
    Cheers

  54. Arturo Ruiz Says:

    @20

    That would be the coup de grâce for an already crippled Dominican Winter League, by all the restrictions put in place by MLB.

    The DWL cultivated a lot of talented players, where they would be showcased and then signed by MLB clubs. Now it's the other way around, where a player first needs to be signed by an MLB team and be in there system before entering the DWL draft.

    I'm not sure how including a spot for DR players in the MLB draft would help a league strugling to keep up with MLB demands.